Swapping Defender front seats in to an 88"

[Forester]

I also have Defender seats in my 88 and should probably refoam them at a minimum. They are a canvas type of material which is dirty and stained. Im thinking that a canvas seat cover would be the way to go.as none of the retrim sets are currently canvas and I don't think leather is a wise move in a Series truck. I'm not particularly impressed with anything Exmoor quality wise so I've found a south african company which I may go with. If anyone has seatcover recommendations I'd love to hear them.
Jim

[RustCollector]

Jim,

Could you share your SA company info with us?

I agree that leather isn't the best choice, and fabric gets dirty. I'm sure that's why vinyl has been OEM for a long time. Easily removable canvas covers would allow cleaning, which would be nice.

[Forester]

Melvill and Moon (https://melvillandmoon.com/seat-covers/) is the company I will most likely go with. I have one of their tire covers and it fit much better than the Exmoor one I had been using.
Jim

[RustCollector]

Jim, that company makes some nice looking gear!

[Forester]

Not sure what the exchange rate is currently but the Rand was considerably lower compared to the dollar when I bought my tire cover.
Jim

[RustCollector]

I saw it at 18 Rand to $1 when I checked the link you posted. I'm sure shipping would be a big deal, and I don't know how long it would take.

Not sure how much an actual seat cover set would cost, since they want me to fill out an order and wait for a quote.

I'm kind of thinking that buying canvas and making covers myself might be a god winter project. It works for my budget, anyway.

[RustCollector]

So, I found myself with a half an hour of time to play with the seats.

I worked on the passenger side seat that I haven't yet installed. I removed the headrest (it's just a press fit) and flexible splines (correct word?) that anchor the seat cover and the plastic rear panel to the perimeter of the seat frame. Then you need to untie knots at both bottom corners to remove the vinyl seat cover. Pretty fast, really. I could do this to the installed seat without removing it, I think.

The foam was glued to the steel frame, but not with a lot of glue, so it came off easy enough. I kept it in the frame just to hold it still while I hacked at it.

Below, this is with the splines, headrest, and back removed. The splines are just hammered in to a slot after the vinyl seat cover and plastic back cover are in there. So, to remove, you just peel out the splines from the bottom. The splines are resting on the ground at left. Rovers North has a video linked in their Exmoor seat cover kit page that shows this pretty well.



Since I couldn't find my electric roast beef carving knife (doesn't everyone have one?), I used a sharp utility knife to score lines every half inch (12mm) or so.

My goal is to remove almost an inch (so, 20mm) from the top edge and feather it down to nothing about 5 inches (125mm) from the bottom. This should allow me to adjust the seat back rake forward by a notch while I move the seat back a notch. I think that'll give me the inch of leg room I'm looking for. It should reduce the distance between my head and the head rest, too.

My foam work isn't, and I think doesn't need to be, anything like smooth and perfect. This is a "work in progress" and I might not notice the rough surface anyway. I'll probably get a proper reupholstery kit this winter or Spring. The stuff you see in this image is hardened and stinky with age.

The image below shows the seat cushion upside down as I was working on it. You can see the baseball sized mouse next just below the knife handle. I have some foam to fill that with, but I might not even notice the hole.




I haven't installed this seat yet, but I loosely reassemble it and tried it on the floor and it did seam like I'm heading in the right direction. Now, I need to remove the driver's seat that I just put in and do this same thing.

This post might not help anyone with reshaping their seats, but you should know that it's really simple to open up one of these seats if you wanted to.

I'm going to attempt some vinyl cover repair while I have it apart, Nothing serious, just a vinyl patch stitched in place by hand. I might try contact cement to hold stuff in place while I use my Speedy Stitcher to sew it up.

[RustCollector]

Update: I swapped out the above modified 110 seat back onto the 110 seat already installed on the driver's side. The driver's side head rest, covers, and foam came off pretty easy in place.

I started to patch up the vinyl cover in one spot, but I got invited to my kids' monopoly game, so I haven't finished it yet.

I have driven it with the new foam shape, and it's way better for me. The amount of foam I hacked out gave me back the adjustment I was looking for.

For you tall guys who want legroom, take the seat back down to the steel frame and try it out. You might want to throw on a thin closed cell foam sheet over it, but it's not too uncomfortable as is. Plus it looks cool, maybe.



Here's the seat with the foam cushion in place. The big hole is where the mice lived for a while. I thought about fixing it, but I don't notice it when seated, I won't bother filling that hole in.
Untill I get the seat cover stitched up, I'm running a beach towel over it to keep the foam bits off of my clothes. I forgot to get a pic of the cover being repaired. It looks terrible, and it won't look better after I fix it.

[64osby]

Just looked on ebay for Defender front seats. Wow, looks like they are worth there weight in Gold or maybe Silver.

And here you are modifying them to your Series. I sure hope they work out great for you.

[RustCollector]

My seats are in "restorable" condition, so I'm not worried about cutting up my priceless foam. The mice started that process anyway. The steel frame does need a paint job, and that'll happen when I properly reupholster them, at some point.

I haven't been to ebay looking for stuff in a while. I usually get discouraged by availability or pricing, and just fix what I have. But if anyone wants to trade silver for my seats, I would be open to discussing it. Whatever happens, it needs to add up to Defender seats in my 88 with minimal cost.

[50 wulf]

...but I got invited to my kids' monopoly game...

Not sure if you've ever played it, but I might suggest giving the game Acquire a try. I've been playing it for 22yrs. My friend, who got me started passed in 18, but he had been playing it since the 70's. Anyway, it doesn't drag on like Monopoly because it ends when the pieces are all played/not playable. Teaches you money, math, stocks, mergers, etc.. (We use poker chips in place of the paper money.)
https://www.amazon.com/Vintage-1968-...es%2C84&sr=1-3

Nice work on the seats. I've been interested in learning upholstery, but have not had the patience for it as of yet, and since it is the last part of my builds, I am usually in a hurry at the end and just spend the money. But it has all certainly gotten more expensive. So far no complaints from my Exmoor high back Series seat.

[RustCollector]

Hey Wulf, I'll look for Acquire. Thanks for the recommendation. One of my boys is now really into board games of all kinds. and he is in the habit of whooping my butt in chess. Monopoly does go on forever normally, but we usually end the game when we have to clear it off of the kitchen table twice a day. Thank God for that.

Seat update: so I said my repairs on these seats would not improve the looks, and I was only a little off. Iron on patches look better than the holes that were there before, and better than I expected. Warning! don't use the highest heat setting on your clothing iron - start off halfway up the heat scale. Vinyl melts way too easy. Iron onto the "leather" side, not the fabric covered inside. The fabric side melts even faster.



The top of both seat backs were torn, exposing the foam. I repaired one seat so far in this area. I used a backing piece of vinyl on the inside to make it stronger and to hold stitching better. That white piece is glued in with contact cement first, then stitched across the tear. This held together better while stitching than just tacking it all together with pins.

I've "installed" this cover, and I'm waiting to repair the top tear in the second cover. For the one you see, I need to run string through the perimeter to replace the busted original stuff. The string is needed to tighten up the cover onto the frame. I tried doing it without string, but it seems to want the tension. I'll get pics of my museum quality work when I'm closer to done.

Comfort report: yes, it's way more comfy than the Series seating. I have a couple hundred miles on them now. They adjust really nicely, much more range than the Series seats. My shorty 11 year old son can scoot the seat forward enough (almost) to drive around the yard comfortably. I can scoot it back and set the seat back angle the way I like it. I can't go back any farther without making the seat back more vertical. My foam hacking gave me just enough room to make the seats very comfortable for me. If I were taller, I'd need to remove some more foam, but there is plenty to remove.

One thing I might do is to remove a bit more foam in the side bolsters of the seat back. Removing foam just from the center part of the seat back sets me deeper into the seat. I like a good tight racing seat for racing (before kids), but this is a bit of a squeezer with winter coats and stuff. Five minutes with a sharp object and I can fix it.

Best part: the iron on patches have made me forget about all the mouse poop that was in the seats.

[64osby]

I once bought an old Suburban that had sat in a farmers field for several years. The mice decided to build nest in the back part of the headliner. Found a replacement at a junkyard. Boy did my eyes water when removing that s***. So nasty!. The Burb was great for many miles after that..

Good luck wrapping up the seats.

[RustCollector]

Thanks, Osby. I'll try not to breath too much of it. At least in this part of the country, mouse poop dust won't kill you. I think out west they have a different kind of mouse poop.

[RustCollector]

Update: it didn't take too long for the iron on patched to just plain fail. The adhesive isn't a good match with vinyl, I guess. I found a 3M "leather seat repair patch" on Amazon and it has stuck so far. I cut it to size and rounded the corners to prevent them from peeling up. There were 2 patches in the kit, with enough to fix all of the holes I had in the outboard seats. The center seat has no holes, yet.

The new patches have a denim feel to them, and and in their current clean condition, they look darker than the vinyl. I'm happy to overlook this and enjoy my "new" seats that have no holes.

For more leg room, I think removing another inch of foam would be an easy, fast fix.

Photo shows the new, darker patch on the seat bottom, and the failed iron-on patches just before I ripped them off of the seat back.



I found an hour and a half recently to swap out the Series seats with the Defender ones, so now all of the front row seats are in. I used the same hardware as on the Series, just not quite as much of it. The new center seat used fewer fasteners than the old one. With the center seat, I had to drill a pair of holes through the top of the seat box, since there was a different hole pattern up front. Instead of two bolts per side of the seat, there was just one hole right between the Series holes. I'm happy to live with a new hole in the old metal for the seat upgrade.

One thing I do miss about the old seats in that the center seat used to fold down, making a full-depth platform that held a small cooler very nicely. The new Defender center seat has a fixed back rest, so no more cooler shelf.

All of my passengers have voted in favor of the seat upgrade. I'll post up some pics of the full install when I have a moment.